[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest             Friday, 11 September 1998     Volume 04 : Number 273

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From: jimandkatemundie@juno.com (James G Mundie)
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 20:19:07 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1598] Re: Baren Digest V4 #271 

I won't enter into this woodblock-as-religious-experience discussion for
fear of angering the printmaking gods.

***
Carolyn wrote:

>What kind of a baren do you use? 
>... The best results from a baren came when I used a very loose, oil based ink. 
>I had no problems with that one.  But I only used one color. Any suggestions? 

As an intermediate step to buying a good (and pricey) baren, why not try
a bamboo spoon?  That's the method I use and I have never (knock on wood)
experienced a printing problem related to the spoon.  One can use it as
bluntly or subltely as one likes.

***
Julio, you've become a regular Graham Scholes with the one-liners!

***
Jeanne wrote:

>When you mentioned that you use a razor blade to start the fine 
>edges, just how do you handle the blade so that you are not minus a finger. I 
>would like to do that also as the blades can be discarded easily when dull. 
>????????? Do you have a special holder ???????

My "special holder" is my fingers.  If you pull up my entry in the
Encyclopedia, you'll see several photographs showing the way I hold the
blade. It requires some practice and care but is easily managed.  I've
known some people to wrap tape around the end they aren't cutting with,
but that is a waste of time (and tape!).  I like being able to just turn
the blade around when one corner becomes dull and not have it be all
sticky with adhesive residue.

Sla/n go tamall, y'all,
James Mundie, Philadelphia USA

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From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 22:48:40 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1599] Re: Paying the rent 

Ray wrote,
>Yes!!  An artist defines him/herself.  They are not defined by others.

I think it works better though if both you _and_  the others think you're
an artist.  

Gary

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From: Ramsey Household <cjramsey@pacbell.net>
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 20:24:37 -0700
Subject: [Baren 1600] Re: Barens 

Ray,
I don't think we disagree, though we may be talking in a parallel stream.

Thank you very much for all the information on the press!

Carolyn

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From: Ray Esposito <brassring@brassring.org>
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 00:15:14 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1601] Re: Paying the rent 

Gary wrote:
>I think it works better though if both you _and_  the others think you're
>an artist.  

Sorry Gary but I don''t buy it.  I create art for me.  I don't care what
others think or how they define me.  I define myself, my art and my inner
world.  Does that mean I don't want or care if people buy my art?  Of
course not.  But I am not going to get exorcised over what others think.
They like it - great.  They don't - that's great too.  Life is too short to
worry about it.

Cheers

Ray Esposito

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From: Jean Eger <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Thu, 10 Sep 1998 23:26:25 -0700
Subject: [Baren 1602] Re: Baren Digest V4 #271 

Graham,
Thanks for your honest anwser about the collectors liking deckles.
Somebopdy once showed me how to wet the paper and then tear it.  It does
give a pretty good imitation of a deckele.  However, wouldn't the
registration into the kento work better with a straight edge rather than a
torn edge?

***

James wrote:
>"The Sacred Cow of Torn Paper" is a new one on me, but I suspect there
>are more menacing bovines to confront.

Thanks, I needed a laugh, James.  

***

Sheryl wrote:
>According to the Graphic Chemicals catalog, the intaglio inks and the
>block printing inks they sell under the banner "Perfection Palette" (or
>something like that) are identical.  I've also used the inks for
>monotypes.  Did you actually try etching ink as block ink and have a 
>problem?

Thanks for noticing that.  I think it might be necessary to add plate oil
to the etching ink, because the etching ink is so stiff.  Is it plate oil,
or something else?  Or do we use litho ink?  The relief inks seem so
expensive, after spending so much on wood and paper.  Maybe my nervous
breakdown is showing again.  I better get back to the catalogs instead of
just asking questions to the universe.  I was in Utrecht in Berkeley
staring at rows of cans of etching inks and little tubes of relief inks.  I
have 22 little guys in my class in the morning, so they are claiming a big
piece of my grey matter.  It's my first teaching job.  I probably won't
remember my own name by next week.

***

Carolyn wrote:
>Here in the Bay
>Area, the only places I can find also rent you the printer (a human who
>does the work for you) and the prices are beyond my means.  Jean, maybe
>you know of a place that lets you rent time on the press and do your own
>printing?

What city are you in?  If you can get to U.C. Berkeley, there is a studio
in the ground floor of the student union.  You pay a fee something like $35
for the semester.  Then you pay a low rate for the use of the press.  It's
called the ASUC studio, something like that.  I'll look it up for you this
weekend and if I forget, remind me. That's the absolute cheapest I have
found.  There's a place called the Graphic Workshop in San Francisco that
has a low monthly rate.  You have to join that.  Or you could just come
over to my house and use my 13" x 23" press for free.

Jean

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 17:09:51 +0900
Subject: [Baren 1603] A busy day ... 

It's late afternoon here in Japan, and _finally_ all our North American
friends are asleep, away from their keyboards, and dreaming about
woodblocks (I hope!).

That was quite a day on [Baren] - our busiest (noisiest?) yet. If each
of the 50 members of the group is getting as much pleasure out of this
communication as I, then that's an awful lot of communal joy!

I'm a member of a couple of other similar forums, but I'm sure that none
of them have such a high 'participation ratio' as ours.  Out of the 50
people currently on our subscription list, there are only 10 who are
hard-core lurkers, having never made a post.  30 of the members are
relatively frequent posters, and another ten more make very occasional
contributions.

This I think, is a fantastic ratio.  And to think that 29 people decided
to join the print exchange is absolutely astonishing.  We seem to really
have a group of _printmakers_, not just people who _talk_ about
printmaking.

***

That large volume of mail yesterday prompts me to remind you again that
[Baren] is available in a 'digest' version, in which messages are
gathered together and dropped in your mailbox only once each day (except
on days when the volume is so large that more than one digest is
produced).  If you're finding the occasional high volume just too much
to handle, this may be a good way to help you control things.

For instructions on how to get the digest, see the [Baren] web site:
http://www.woodblock.com/forum

***

And now, while you dozens of North Americans over there are busy sawing
logs, we five Japanese members of [Baren] are busy cutting our wood in a
different way!

Dave B.

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From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:22:14 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1604] re: japanese art 

Gary writes:
>I cannot believe that in the country that gave the modern world some of
>its most outstanding art and literature and architecture and paper and 
>calligraphy and theatre, that there were no "artists" around, only businessmen....

I never said that there were no artists in Japan. Only that the carvers &
printers of woodblock prints were not considered as such. Of course there
were (or are !) master carvers & printers...capable of creating great
works....but the japanese considered them great craftsmans...not artists. I
think this is very well documented in all the print history books. There
are also many other forms of japanese art that was being done around the
ukiyo-e period besides print-making. The traditional painting schools in
japan  (Kano & Tosa) were in status of stagnation when ukiyo-e came to
be.......never mind this .... I am blah, blah, blah  again.  These are not
necessarily my views, this is what japanese print books tell us.

The work of Utamaro and the others is of course great art. The fact that
their work has brought enjoyment & inspiration to countless generations
marks their place in history. That woodblock printmaking is a reproductive
process, aimed at creating multiples for the purpose of making the output
available to many (and making money) , does not in any way or form demean
the creative forces and the great artistry of these men.

I quote: "...neither the medium nor the size of a picture or print is of
importance when assessing its aesthetic value...it is the quality of
draughtsftmanship, composition and expressiveness that are the ultimate
bases of assessment..."

ps.      If all the world is a stage, where is the audience sitting?

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From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 03:32:25 -0500
Subject: [Baren 1605] re: dreaming about... 

Dave writes:
>It's late afternoon here in Japan, and _finally_ all our North American
>friends are asleep, away from their keyboards, and dreaming about
>woodblocks (I hope!)."

Not a chance. Unfortunately I have some problems at work and I am doing
support from home. Because we run most of our batch jobs at night, when
things go wrong....I am usually up this time of night...it's nice to be
able to catch up on the baren  postings ....from home.

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From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 07:50:45 -0400
Subject: [Baren 1606] re: japanese art 

>ps.      If all the world is a stage, where is the audience sitting?

It's theater in the round, Julio!

Gary

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From: Cucamongie@aol.com
Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 08:11:13 EDT
Subject: [Baren 1607] gum arabic 

I could say a lot more regarding "spirit" (and I don't mean anything to do
with organized religion) but I think I'll hold off for the moment - it's too
early in the morning here to start getting that riled up!  Actually I want to
ask something more practical right now.  I just started mixing my own paints
for printmaking using pure pigment, gum arabic and glycerine, and a little
calcium carbonate.  When I went to buy gum arabic I found that there were
different kinds and prices - for example, Winsor Newton makes gum arabic that
comes in a small, 2.5 oz container that's about $5.00, but there are also
other types of gum arabic that are made for doing lithography, etc that are
much cheaper and you get a lot more for your money.  Do any of you know if it
makes much difference in the quality of the pigment if you use the cheaper
variety?  
Got to get to carving now --

Sarah Hauser

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End of Baren Digest V4 #273
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