[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking. Baren Digest Monday, 4 January 1999 Volume 06 : Number 396 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 11:30:06 -0600 Subject: [Baren 2475] re: "Fragility" & others Hi Graham Enjoyed your new print very much, it's the kind of subject I like to work with. A technical question if I may; how do you get all the subtles tones on the sky ? Is that many blocks ? (if so how do you blend in the hard edges of the wood block ?) or is it one block printed with different colors overlapping like a wash ???? different amount of pressure on the paper ? I am looking for some details here ! This would have been a great print for the exchange...won't you reconsider coming back onboard ? Hope everything is going well with your upcoming projects. Thanks, ..JULIO. ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 11:55:38 -0600 Subject: [Baren 2476] re: Dave's show Glad everything is going great with the exhibition....... When are you going to setup the live Baren-web-camera so that we can all monitor your show from the net ? We can all peek in and get live-pics from the show!!! All the best... JULIO ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 12:03:11 -0600 Subject: [Baren 2477] re: Dave's show 2 I was kind of kidding first, but then... I don't know what it would take.... and I know you are too busy to do this.... But perhaps the TV people doing the show could arrange some set up like that....you know a web-camera! That would be great for us to be able to "be there" with you. Come on Dave, you got nine days! All the best... JULIO ------------------------------ From: amoss@mindspring.com (JOHN AMOSS) Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 14:11:26 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Baren 2478] kento adjustments Hello- I'd like to ask anyone in the group about kento adjustments. For adding to the kentos (making them closer to the artwork), I have used the process of first making an incision with a chisel alongside the existing kento and inserting a slice of wood, but I have found that it's hard to get a consistent thickness to the pieces and worry that they will loosen, especially since I am working with a wet block. Any tricks up a sleeve here? I was thinking of using metal glazing points similar to what is used in framing but they may rust. Another thought was next time intentionally making the kento marks a bit closer than correct and then shaving them down at the proofing stage....the old woodworking adage- it's easier to take away than add... learning,learning Thanks to all! - -John ------------------------------ From: Graham Scholes Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 11:27:38 -0800 Subject: [Baren 2479] Re: "Fragility" & others Julio, The sky is printed with 5 colours 1 red and 4 blues, two of which are different hues. There are 4 plates. Sky, foreground, middleground and water. >(if so how do you blend in the hard edges of the wood block ?) I don't understand the question!! Uniform pressure on the paper and nothing differs from colour to colour. It is just a straight forward bump-and-grind printing job no secrets. >This would have been a great print for the exchange...won't you reconsider >coming back onboard ? On checking the web site I see I neglected to put the size of the edition of 35 prints. It would not be possible to get back in on the exchange because the size is bigger than the allowable. The paper size for the print is 17 x 28. This is one reason I stepped away from the exchange. Because of the exhibition at the Victoria Art Gallery I needed to create some large pieces and the small paper size of the exchange (10 x 15 I think) was not in the scheme of things. I mentioned the new piece, Fantasia Suite, it is on 22" x 28" paper size. Cheers Graham If there is anything else I can help with ....... well you know. ------------------------------ From: "Ray Esposito" Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 14:41:44 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2480] video It has been brought to my attention that some time back I offered to pick up the costs to return the video to Dave and that's why my name kept being pushed to the bottom. Since my unnamed source is usually impeccable, especially when snowed in by 24 inches, I apologise for that part of my bitch. However, I do not retract my point that if you are going to accept the responsibility you owe it to others to follow through by viewing, copying and passing it on in a timely manner.. Cheers Ray ------------------------------ From: "Ray Esposito" Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 14:43:24 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2481] Re: kento adjustments John I think you want to take a look at Matt's system. I have used it and its great. Cheers Ray ------------------------------ From: Jean Eger Date: Sun, 03 Jan 1999 14:29:11 -0800 Subject: [Baren 2482] Re: Baren Digest V6 #395 April, I'm using student Hosho. (Do you have any other paper suggestions?) So far i have made 13 quasi-acceptable six-color prints. It is clear that I am not professional in the rice-paste-print department. So I have to ask myself, do I go on and produce the rest for the edition, which is really a great learning experience. Or do I stop and make a decent black-and-white oil print? The pigment plus rice paste produces a beautiful translucent color, similar to watercolor, that I can't achieve with oil-based inks. I know because I tried to make a few copies in oil and they were not nearly as pretty as the water-based prints, even with all the little balls and blotches. I think the paper-fiber problem can be solved by making smaller batches, then washing the block and brushes. For example, five at a time instead of 15 at a time. I cover the back with plastic before I baren it. I have discarded the three prints which were out of register, a result of slipping when I picked up the print to re-ink. The kento method is really an excellent way of registering the print, and not hard to use. My main problem is getting too much ink on the block and then having it blob out around the edges. If I try less ink, then it barely prints. What's the solution? Print over and over and over? Dave you might have to produce a videotape yourself and sell it to us. That would solve the sending-the-tape problem. Now I'm off to Berkeley to buy more paper. What an expensive hobby! (Almost as expensive as software.) Jean ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 18:09:35 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2483] Yes, I'm still here ... To the group: I hope Dave's whole message doesn't reappear here, but I was having trouble sending out mail from my address book address for Baren, so am including it as a "reply" to Dave's last message. Last year seemed to go by before I could realize some of my intentions regarding Baren. I wanted to demonstrate some of my design development using the computer, and I talked about creating "a new genre" of woodblock prints. My new "genre" is done in the computer media until they go into production and become real woodblock prints. Hence the idea of the subscription page. For those interested in seeing some of my recent work, you may go to: http://www.hanga.com/subscriptions.html The page is still in construction, and likely will be for a little while yet, so please ignore all but the images. If you skip down the face page of Print Subscriptions and click on "Subscription Form", then click on the individual thumbnails when they appear, for enlargements, you'll get an idea of what I've been doing lately. Gary ------------------------------ From: "Ray Esposito" Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 18:29:07 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2484] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... Gary All I get is an error message. I did try http://www.hanga.com and got in but you are not listed. Problem? ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 20:33:51 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2485] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... Ray, When I followed the bookmark link to the page, no problem. The address that shows on the top box is what I then copied for all of you, though when I typed in that address I got the same message as you did. It is a trial page, not accessible from Hanga Gallery, so you can't get there that way. Is there another way I can track down the address from my bookmark page, I don't see anywhere I can go to get that information? Sorry about that. I'll poke around some more and see if anything turns up. In the meantime I'm open for suggestions. Gary ------------------------------ From: Gary Luedtke Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 20:49:58 -0500 Subject: [Baren 2486] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... To Ray and All, I sifted through some old e-mail and found this address for the site which features some of my recent work, I tried it, and it works. Hope it does for you too. Let me know if not. http://www.hanga.com/subscription.html >> Gary ------------------------------ From: Matthew.W.Brown@VALLEY.NET (Matthew W Brown) Date: 03 Jan 99 22:57:55 EST Subject: [Baren 2487] Kento adjustments John, Your idea of cutting kento a bit too far in and then removing later is right on in my book. When you need to go the other way however, there is a trick that seems to help: try placing a drop of Krazy glue in your 'cut' before driving in your little 'sliver'. Keiji Shinohara got me onto this Krazy glue stuff and it is handy to have by your printing bench for quick repairs, etc. Sets up in a minute or two and is very strong; if your sliver is too thick you can remove a shaver with your knife. Matt ------------------------------ From: Graham Scholes Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 20:58:00 -0800 Subject: [Baren 2488] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... Got a big error message 'Error 404: Not Found ' >click on "Subscription Form", So where does one find this????? ------------------------------ From: Graham Scholes Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 21:04:04 -0800 Subject: [Baren 2489] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... Gary, Nope that doesn't work either. Graham ------------------------------ From: Graham Scholes Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 21:13:23 -0800 Subject: [Baren 2490] Re: Kento adjustments Matt wrote.... >try placing a drop of Krazy glue in your 'cut' before driving in your little >'sliver'. Keiji Shinohara got me onto this Krazy glue stuff and it is handy to >have by your printing bench for quick repairs, etc. Sets up in a minute or two >and is very strong; if your sliver is too thick you can remove a shaver with >your knife. > Instead of cutting the sliver down with a knive I use a little 120 sandpaper on a block of wood to get the exact hieght. Make sure it is securely glued. For just these situations I have a veneer of wood that can easily be cut to fill the space.....and always bigger so I can cut it back to the proper position to adjust the register. by the say I use a piece of double sided tape made by 3M which works well and is instant. Not as secure as the Krazy glue, but it works as there is no pressure or tention on the section of the Kento. Graham ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Sun, 3 Jan 1999 23:56:08 -0600 Subject: [Baren 2491] re: gary's web site Gary: Got to your site ok, I see you have been busy. Beautiful prints, tell us more about your designing via a PC (oops, I hear Graham screaming !). How does a guy living in Kansas come up with such beautiful landscapes of Hawaii ? I think I told you before that I enjoy your prints very much. Your appreciation for the work of Hiroshige really comes thru. Big bold lanscapes with accent on composition & color. I even found some little people (ala Hiroshige) in a couple of your prints (Banzai, Oahu & Kilauea, Kauai) right ? When I see your work, I think Hiroshige 1998! How is this subscription business going to work ? Won't you have a long wait to get 25 subscribers thru the net ? Do you have the carver/printer already line up ? Again I will say that I miss not having you and Graham in the exchange. You both do such a fantastic job at capturing the beautiful subtle colors of the landscape. You two have played such a big part in the success of the Baren forum. Graham: Thanks for the description on "Fragility". That's exactly what I was looking for.....I see what you mean about the print size not matching up to the exchange requirements. Great print! I had sometime inside over the holidays, specially since we got 20" of snow on Saturday....and I revisited many of the members web-sites. What a great collection of artists we have here! I enjoy Matt's & Andrea's, & both the Jean's and Bill's, Hideshi's, etc, etc. I started thinking about not measuring up to these guys as far as printmaking and had to go back and re-read some of Ray's & Bill's postings about this problem to snap out of it. There is so much talent and beautiful prints out there ! Bye for now.... JULIO ------------------------------ Subject: [Baren 2492] Re: Yes, I'm still here ... Personal post sent to [Baren] in error ... ------------------------------ From: Gregory Robison Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 23:02:08 +0300 Subject: [Baren 2493] Amateur; Triage; Endeavors Kampala, 4 January 1999 Thank-you to all who sent me greetings over this channel and privately. I am happy to be with this merry band of people with inky fingers, and wish you all a happy and productive 1999.=20 Gary: I appreciate your wording of the question as to whether I "earn my livelihood" from printmaking, rather than saying "are you a professional?" I have sold prints, but printmaking and the graphic arts in general are a "cost center" for me. (I am a venture capitalist.) As a printmaker, I therefore consider myself an "amateur" -- a term I distinguish, however, from "dilettante." My suspicion is that practically none of us makes his or her living exclusively or even mostly from prints. This would be in keeping with the history of the art. Nearly every printmaker I have ever heard of was primarily a painter, an art instructor, a writer, an insurance salesman... There may be some room for a new term or at least concept besides that of "professional" and "amateur" with respect to this kind of work, and it may have to do with a Baren-like affiliation with other artists who are committed to some technical or esthetic standard, or fidelity to some tradition=85 Bill and Jean: I think triage is an apt word for an important aspect of our work. Triage is one of those World War I terms that addressed a grisly technical problem of those days: how to keep the (relatively) few combat surgeons focused, in the face of an overwhelming quantity of cases, on the ones that had a chance to survive and not waste their time on those that were going to die anyway. It therefore did have to do limited resources. But it also had to do with intelligent selection. For us, in printing, it's "culling." Not everything we print is worth preserving. Not everything we pull can be saved. Not every block is even worth printing from. If we waste our time trying to salvage everything, we'll never get anywhere. We have to know when to let something die and move on to the next case... We also have to have the stomach to produce a lot of garbage in the course of making something worthwhile.=20 I also think, Andrea, that this is why seeing the works of others can sometimes be so discouraging. What we almost invariably see of others' output is really only the "apres-triage," the culled work. We're seeing the survivors holding the high ground, but not all the casualties it took to get there. (My wife says I use too many military metaphors...I'm working on it.) =20 I don't say this because you need to hear it from me, Andrea (one look at your output, even in digital form, proves you don't have any hang-ups about this=85or is it hanga - ups?), but because it's one of the primary struggles of us "non-professionals:" why keep going when so much of what we do seems like garbage (and we've got a daytime job that pays better and that people say we do well)? Jeanne, your similar comment about visiting the Louvre this fall reminded me of a statement by Simone Weil, which I remembered as "Great artists aren't intimidated by museums," but, when I looked it up, was: "Quand un peintre de reelle valeur va dans un musee, son originalite en est confirmee." (I'm not on my Mac today, and I can't seem to get accents easily into this text. Sorry.) You apparently go to museums as I do, not to be soothed by the concentration of so much beauty, but to be troubled and challenged and prodded... It's a good visit when you can trot down the museum's front steps saying to yourself, "back to work!" I guess the key with respect to the work of others is to fall somewhere between Georgia O'Kieffe, who reputedly never went to galleries because she didn't care for anyone's work but her own, and poor old Sylvia Plath, who never read a novel she admired without grinding her teeth and fretting that "here's another great book I'll never write." It killed her, of course. Steven Covey notwithstanding, we do compare ourselves to others and, in my view, should (provided we do it in a balanced way and don't simply stop producing or put our head in the oven as a result). That's why I have great respect for participants in this forum such as Graham, and others who are "professionals" in the old sense: they make a living at this. "Making a living" means subjecting yourself to comparisons with others in the marketplace. And if you can induce people to choose your work instead of spending their money on something else, and still do what you like to do and don't enslave yourself to a perception of "what the public wants," then great. There's a lot more validity to that than going around saying, "I'm an artist and my work is wonderful. Trust me." =20 I guess that's why I'm happy to hear Ray try to be so encouraging with exhortations like "your prints will all be gems." We know it's not true, but his point is that we can't let ourselves get discouraged. New Years resolution: future contributions to the forum to be short, pertinent and technical! Gregory ------------------------------ End of Baren Digest V6 #396 ***************************