[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest              Monday, 22 February 1999      Volume 06 : Number 456

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From: mkrieger@mb.sympatico.ca
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 06:58:24 -0600
Subject: [Baren 3143] I think I'm purring 

Thanks Jeanne, David and Jack for the notes of appreciation. I
particularly like thinking about the word elegant as I sit here before
breakfast in my dishabille.

John, I like the sponge analogy as well (as you can tell, I like
analogy, period). I always hated that Q & A set that goes Do it this
way? Why? Because I said so!. It is so much more interesting to figure
out the answer.

Jeanne, its hard not to be longwinded with such an appreciative captive
audience but I can rest easy for certain members of this list will make
sure I know it if I ever trespass too far.

Mary Krieger

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From: Cucamongie@aol.com
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 09:23:29 EST
Subject: [Baren 3144] blank areas 

Thanks to all who responded to my post - I'm doing another run of prints today
and/or tomorrow - I'll let you know how it goes!
Sarah

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From: Gary Luedtke <GLuedtke@compuserve.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 13:52:52 -0500
Subject: [Baren 3145] Pricing 

For Dave and others,

Dave, when you described your pricing philosophy you
 mentioned your cost of materials, postage, your basic
 overhead, etc. and you arrived at the lowest price you
 could afford to stay in business at and also keep your
 prices within the budget of common ordinary folk.

Someone mentioned that only 2 % of all artists were actually
able to support themselves thru their craft, which means of
course that the 98%  do other work to make their living.
As in my own case, this other work also provides other 
benefits, such as health insurance, sick leave, vacation, and 
retirement.   Are you calculating simular things into your 
overhead or are you calculating only your "current" over-
head?    Would this not be a prudent inclusion if it is not
currently calculated in?   Other things of a practical nature
would of course be college tuition for your children, any
child support necessary in the mean time, and a retirement 
supplement.   I don't know how things work in Japan, but 
here Social Security is not enough to live on, you 
need all the help you can get to survive retirement.   I think
all of these would be reasonable factors in your pricing
structure, as they are in most if not all the wages of other
working folk.

I know Graham is self-employed in both his lines of work, art
and the Bed and Bite.   How do you factor those things into
your pricing, Graham, if you don't mind my asking?   Of course,
any others who support themselves by their art are welcome 
to speak up.

I have the feeling that your prices are simply designed to
survive the present, as many self-employed craftspeople's
are, but as you seem to have discovered that collectors 
are willing to pay seven times the initial price for your work, 
perhaps it's time to add in these other reasonable facets 
of your overhead, if you're not already.

Just some extemporaneous thoughts.

Gary

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From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@home.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 12:25:40 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3146] Re: Pricing 

Gary wrote....
>I know Graham is self-employed in both his lines of work, art
>and the Bed and Bite.   How do you factor those things into
>your pricing, Graham, if you don't mind my asking?   Of course,
>any others who support themselves by their art are welcome
>to speak up.

I have nothing do anything with the B&B, that is Marns. It isn't much as
she is only active 2 1/2 month over the summer. We are too far out of
Victoria to get people off season.

Nothing like that is factored in. I don't figure out the cost and then add
a mark up.  I researched the competition (artist at the same level and
experience) and priced accordingly.

It is lean times these days.  The sales have all but stopped.  Can't figure
why. Over the last couple of years we could figure on 2 or 3 pieces a
month. Not so for the last 4 months.  If anybody has a crystal ball ......
would you sell it?

Regards,

Graham

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From: "Don S Rich" <DARICH@prodigy.net>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 12:59:34 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3147] oil base ink 

Yes Chris I print with oil base ink and roll it onto the black then print
on dry paper.
I use an etching press to print as well as the baren to highlight areas and
to print small blocks.

Andrea

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From: Mariten@aol.com
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 18:41:07 EST
Subject: [Baren 3148] Re: oil based ink, dampen, sticking, and a partridge . . . 

From Maria in Las Vegas

'Twas said: 
>I'm just curious, is there anyone in the group that uses regular waterbased
>or oilbased ink and rolls it on the block, and prints on dry paper? More
>like the "European method" from what I understand.

I use the oily stuff rolled on the block with no problems. I do, however,
dampen my paper and am curious why you do not; the quality of the print
improves no matter what type of paper you use, and the process of dampening is
easy, not time consuming, and worth the extra work. A couple of days ago Julio
gave an excellent explanation of how damp your paper should be. But I'm all
for experimenting! I recommend trying out all types of paper so that you get a
feel for how they "take" the inks, water or oil.
As for paper sticking to the block, use Daniel Smith's Miracle Gel for oil
based inks and, presto! no more sticking. In dry climates the paper gets dry
very quickly after removing from the stack, and this additive has saved many a
good sheet of Japanese paper.
Print on, masters and students!

Maria

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From: Phil Bivins <pbivins@mindspring.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 20:22:34 -0500
Subject: [Baren 3149] Munakata with a twist 

This is my attempt to age a print that I copied of Munakata's. I wrinkled
up the paper to breakdown the sizing and paper fibers. I then applied
several applications of strong coffee. After this dried overnight, I then
ironed the paper flat. I hope Munakata doesn't mind, I gave it my best
shot. Thanks, Phil

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From: April Vollmer/John Yamaguchi <jy6@columbia.edu>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 22:08:37 -0400
Subject: [Baren 3150] Sarah's Dog 

Sarah: And here's my two cents to add to Grahm's, Dave's and Julio's!

First, a good stiff paper is less likely to fall into the low areas. Then
try cutting large empty areas LOWER, without getting any pigment in the big
low areas. If the empty area is too big, though, the problem could be
solved in the cutting. If the dog is REALLY BIG, leave a smooth uninked
island in the middle to support the paper over the large empty area.

If the dog is medium sized, you could leave some doggy details, like lines
that would print, inside the empty dog area, again, to support the paper
over the large non-printing area so it doesn't sink into the low area and
pick up color.

April Vollmer

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From: April Vollmer/John Yamaguchi <jy6@columbia.edu>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 20:30:16 -0400
Subject: [Baren 3151] Everybody can't catch everything 

Dave and Ray, great idea to transfer points of interest to us workaholics
from BA5. As you know, I hate to miss anything!

I was especially interested in the discussion about recovering barens. One
reason I use my ball bearing baren (from McClain's) so much is that it
never needs recovering. It is heavier than a hon baren and not as trim, but
it doesn't need a cover!

I wish there were an Aiko's here in NYC where I could have an expert do it
for $5! Part of the problem is it is so hard to practice, since the things
are so expensive. I tried a friend's bamboo patch, but the sheaths are all
too small to use, even for practice. The ones McClain's has are on the
small side, too.

And when DAVE says its "difficult frustrating difficult awkward
difficult and frustrating" you know it's not something I'm going to pick up
right away!

TIPS: The sheaths DO last longer if you rub them on a square of felt with
mineral oil on it every few prints. And if you rub WITH the grain of the
sheath. It is also very important to TURN the coil within the sheath often
so the bumps hit a different portion of the sheath during printing. And you
can patch that first rip with a bit of scotch tape...But then you're on
your own!

I wrestled with sumi for a while myself, but I gave up.

April Vollmer

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From: Bill Ritchie <ritchie@seanet.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 18:30:39 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3152] Re: Everybody can't catch everything 

>I wrestled with sumi for a while myself, but I gave up.

I hate to nit-pick, but isn't it sumo wrestling? Not sumi wrestling. Sumi
wrestling is when wrestlers deliberately try to get legal action against
themselves.

Bill H. Ritchie, Jr.

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From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@home.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 19:33:59 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3154] Re: Munakata with a twist 

Phil wrote....
>This is my attempt to age a print that I copied of Munakata's.

When you do this do you put his name on the print or reference to the
originator.

Graham

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 12:19:12 +0900
Subject: [Baren 3153] Re: Pricing 

Gary wrote:
 
> Dave, when you described your pricing philosophy you
>  mentioned your cost of materials, postage, your basic
>  overhead, etc. and you arrived at the lowest price you
>  could afford to stay in business at and also keep your
>  prices within the budget of common ordinary folk.
> 
> ... health insurance, sick leave, vacation, and retirement.
> Are you calculating simular things into your overhead or 
> are you calculating only your "current" over-head?    

Good points ...

I just gave a simplistic outline of how I arrived at my prices.  When I
say that I added up my 'rent ... food ... cost of woodblocks, etc.', I
didn't mean to imply that such things as health insurance were being
ignored.  

I should have explained that I took as a 'base' the fundamental cost of 
the sort of life I lead here, before adding in things like the printmaking 
costs.

Health insurance?  Yes, totally covered.

Sick leave?  Vacations?  Not specifically, but my general schedule of
doing ten prints a year leaves me with quite a lot of flexibility with
time.  I work a lot.  I hike, walk, take vacations, and yes, even spend
a day or so in bed with the flu occasionally.

Retirement?  This one I ignore completely.  I haven't the slightest
intention of ever retiring.  I'm _already_ retired!  (If you take 'to
retire' to mean 'stop working, and start playing')

So anyway, to answer your question, my 'overhead' does include all the
things that I feel are necessary for a normal life.

***

Phil wrote:
> This is my attempt ....

Phil, this _sounds_ interesting, but of course we would like to see it. 
Did you send an attachment?  If so, then the server will have
rejected it ...

If you don't have access to a web page where you can put up the
image, then email it to me (personally, off-list), and I'll put it up 
somewhere where everybody can have a look.

I've heard of people here using tea to artificially age prints, and have
tried it myself (for fun), but I've never heard about coffee!  Does the
print smell like Java?

***

April wrote:
> I tried a friend's bamboo patch, but the sheaths are all
> too small to use, even for practice. The ones McClain's has are on the
> small side, too.

Most of the skins I get are on the narrow side - the best ones usually
are (big wide ones are nearly always quite thick). But once they are
wet, you can stretch them wider with your hands, usually by up to about
2 centimeters.
 
They then shrink down so tight that you can't even turn the inner coil
until after a few dozen print impressions ...

***

A while ago there was a discussion about archival tape and various
substitutes.  Maria in LV volunteered to find the posting and collect
them into an Encyclopedia page, and this morning her collation 
arrived.

http://www.woodblock.com/encyclopedia/updates.html

Thanks, Maria!

Dave

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From: Jack Reisland <reislandj001@hawaii.rr.com>
Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 18:33:39 -1000
Subject: [Baren 3155] Re: Everybody can't catch everything 

Bill Ritchie wrote:
> I hate to nit-pick, but isn't it sumo wrestling? Not sumi wrestling.

That was our point, too.

Jack Reisland

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From: ArtSpot@aol.com
Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 01:44:21 EST
Subject: [Baren 3157] Re: Munakata with a twist 

I believe that tea makes a wonderful dye. I observed an ancestor's wedding
dress, used twice, that had been dyed over a hundred years ago. Still looked
good.

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End of Baren Digest V6 #456
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