[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest              Sunday, 28 February 1999      Volume 06 : Number 465

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From: "Jean Eger" <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:48:34 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3273] Re:   Baren Digest V6 #464 

Jeanne,
Dissatisfaction is what drives some of us to create again and again thinking
that we will someday get better.  We have become artists and have produced a
whole lot of art work.

JeanE

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From: "Ray Esposito" <brassring@brassring.org>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 16:12:03 -0500
Subject: [Baren 3274] Re:   Baren Digest V6 #463  

Agatha wrote:
>my question is about the use of a dremmel tool in
>woodcuts. 

Agatha:

Rather than rehash the Dremel thing all over, I suggest you check out the
encyclopedia at http://www.woodblock.com/forum/archives/archives.html
volume 6, numbers 424 and 425.  There may be others.  After you have read
through these, you will have direct questions we can get into.  I use a
Dremel.

Cheers
Ray

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From: "Jean Eger" <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 13:33:42 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3275] Re:   Baren Digest V6 #464

Thanks for the kind words about my new little print.

Re: ball bearing barens.  The adventurous among us could try making our own
baren from the light pull chain which is easily available in a hardware
store.

Not only does Dan Smith know inks, but his salesmen do too.  One of his
salesmen told me all about  the history of natural materials used for ink in
ancient Japanese woodblock prints.  Maybe that was Dan Smith himself?

Jean Eger

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From: "Jeanne N. Chase" <studiojnc@prodigy.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 16:42:43 -0500
Subject: [Baren 3276] Re:   Baren Digest V6 #463

Jean

Wonderful print Jean. i always enjoy visiting your pages. Do you do
watercolors AND oil based woodcuts?
I am anxious to actually SEE a woodcut done in watercolor. Over the net and
in my printmaking books they seem to have a glow that is not found in oil
based woodblocks.
See you After 5

Jeanne

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From: Gayle Wohlken <blueman@pantek.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 17:47:20 -0500
Subject: [Baren 3277] Re: Baren Digest V6 #464 

Sarah, I tried preparing that brush this afternoon.
I wore my respirator mask so breathing was okay.
But to tell you the truth, I'm not certain I got the thing
the way it is supposed to be--soft on the ends like sable.
Mine is still wet from the dips in the water, and I did 
everything you said.  First I singed it.  (In fact, I singed
it several times because I wasn't sure if it was singed
enough.)  I dipped it in water, then I put a lot of pressure
on the brush and swiped it over the dragonskin for a 
long time (dipping it in water from time to time--the brush I mean).
I tried brushing it across my face to test the softness and I
swear I can barely tell any difference.  I think I worked for
20 minutes on it.  Shouldn't that have done it?

* * *

I bought a supply of kitakata paper today as I got a chance
to go into Cleveland.  As some of you know, this is my
favorite paper for black and white oil based woodblock
prints.  But since I was there,  I looked for powdered pigments 
and they didn't have any.  This is a store that sells to 
Cleveland Institute of Art students.  I was surprised they
didn't have the pigments.

* * *
Jean E. I like your color block print.  The transparencies are nice.

Gayle Wohlken

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 08:41:28 +0900
Subject: [Baren 3278] Permanence ... 

April wrote:
> I think Dave is using the traditional Japanese palette, which I suppose we
> can't complain about, since so much great art has been made that way.
> However,Vermillion is not lightfast, and is recommended AGAINST by several
> authorities. And Indigo the same. I suppose the optimal light conditions he
> describes, that gentle sideways light, wouldn't effect those colors so
> much. But those barbarians from the US are likley to put up prints in
> DIRECT SUNLIGHT don't you think?

Great!  I've been wanting to use that 'b' word for some of you guys
'over there' ever since [Baren] started up - and now April has given me
'permission'!

***

I've listened to the discussion on permanence and lightfastness, but
have to say that I don't have much interest in this.  My prints are
going to fade.  Period.  And I'm going to die too ... and so are you. 
That's the way things are.

I feel we have to approach this with a bit of common sense.  If I were
to sell a print that used a pigment that was _so_ fugitive that it would
be gone in a couple of months, most collectors would find that generally
unacceptable.  But these pigments that I am using, even though some of
them are not 'lightfast', will not be gone in a month, nor in a few
years.  As the decades go by, they will start to fade and become mellow
and gentle in effect.  A 'just-made' woodblock print is hard, bright,
brittle and brash.  The passage of time turns it into an object of
indescribeable beauty.

The Meiji-era prints that I own are just now reaching their peak.  The
paper is nicely toned, the sizing has completely disappeared, leaving a
silky softness behind.  The brittle hardness of the colours has faded
...  They are absolutely gorgeous. Add on another hundred years or so,
and they start to lose it.  The balance between pigments becomes lost as
they fade out at different rates, and the paper becomes so deeply toned
that the overall effect can become gloomy ...  It becomes an old and
dark 'antique'.

But at 47 years of age now, it hurts me a great deal to know that I will
_never_ be able to enjoy seeing my own 'hundred year old' prints ...


***

Greg wrote:
> What do you do, Daniel (and Graham), just paint a swatch
> and leave it on the roof for a fortnight?

When I first started using the Japanese pigments, I too, had been
concerned about this.  (I too, was young and foolish -  'a new
generation of sophisticated, technically curious artists ... obsessed
with the permanence issue' ...)

So I ran a small 'test'.  I took two prints made with the watercolours I
had been using up until then (Holbein's'), and two prints made with the
powder pigments, and taped them to my balcony wall, where they were
directly exposed to the sun and rain.

What can I report?  Well, after a couple of months the watercolours had
started to become rather 'washed-out'.  Not a surprise as the prints
were being literally washed by the rain ...  But the other two prints
were pretty much unchanged.  The experiment came to an abrupt conclusion
on August afternoon, when a typhoon came through ...

Where are those four prints now, I wonder ... 

Dave

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From: ArtSpot@aol.com
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 20:58:42 EST
Subject: [Baren 3279] Re:  Colors & other topics 

Hello New Friends.

I have been riveted in reading your many comments regarding various
printmaking subjects. 

Just a little info here.. Did you know that the cadmiums were about to be
banned shortly before Desert Storm? It was a particular environmental bill....
which had a two thou per incident penalty for manuf, importing or selling
deterrant. No allowances were made for conservators, let alone artists. It did
have some effect -- just look at the yellow lines down USA streets... it is
now a different color. So some things good come out. And as for the
regulation? It didn't go anywhere, perhaps due to the timing.

I understand from other sources read in the past that the color migrating
factor thru paper is a very important one regarding apparent fading. Also
certain paints are not developed for certain applications. As for Daniel
Smith's credibility, I'd like to kibbutz and say that his reputation is
deservedly very high. Having been given a tour of the back areas and having
been an enthusiastic customer over many years, my experience has been of
consistant top quality. Any place that will admit that they don't know
something rather than hazard guesses gets my vote but it also goes beyond
that. About the only problem I've ever had with them is their frame crew
doesn't always make sure to maintain stock, so order in advance! 

Speaking of R.Mayer's "Handbook for Artists", if you see a 4th edition or
earlier do snatch it up. The later editions are so enamoured of scientific
chit chat that the messages get lost in the medium.

Emily Carr's life and work continue to fascinate me. Her thoughts and regard
for Native American history and life, for the grandeur of Nature and for being
a very pure person (hated being a landlady, could've cared less about hardly
anything other than her friends, be they four or two footed, and her art,
hated dressing up, lived in a caboose in the woods).... well, anyways....

Thanks for reading this.

ArtSpot Out
Benny Alba at OMebase 

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From: Becky or Roger Ball <beckorro@inquo.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:28:27 -0700
Subject: [Baren 3280] Jean's latest 

It's beautiful, Jean!

Cheers!

- -Roger

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From: ArtSpot@aol.com
Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 21:22:48 EST
Subject: [Baren 3281] JeanE's print, Bay Area info, possible group show? 

Hope that you come to Printmakers this upcoming session, Jean. I'd like to
view that print in person! I have enjoyed the famed print you gave me quite a
bit.

McBeath is pricy but usually has the stock. El Cerrito Mill & Lumber Co. puts
birch thru a "sticker" (cuts wood to shape, in this case framing material)
every coupla yrs for Buffalo to make my frames. Pricing may have to do with
the amount requested?  Since I am currently working on canvases 4 x 5 ft, we
can go through the lumber fast. I think that both places are aok. El Cerrito's
sticker set up fee is around 100 smackers, so plan in advance..... of course.

Some day we could all meet in person.... Maybe even have a modest show? I've
got the place... once it stops being a collander (rain, old building) in
Oakland. Could be fun! Maybe during ProArts Open Studios in a year or two?

ArtSpot Out
BA at OMebase

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From: "Daniel Kelly" <daniel@vowel.or.jp>
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 13:10:23 +0900
Subject: [Baren 3282] color test 

Greg (Robison) asks:   
  What do you do, Daniel (and Graham), just paint a swatch
> and leave it on the roof for a fortnight?

Thats a good way. Or just protect from light half of some paper with paint
on it and tape to to the window. BTW the print of mine which is faded is
exposed to office type tube lights, not sunlight.

I like what you write about colors and their sellers. But Carbon, being an
element, is it not also inert?

D

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From: "Daniel Kelly" <daniel@vowel.or.jp>
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 12:39:00 +0900
Subject: [Baren 3283] Re: Baren Digest V6 #463 

Gayle asks:
> So, Daniel, what range of colors do you recommend?  Same
> as Dave, except for the Cadmium Red Light in place of Vermillion?

These days all the work I do is with water based media.
I often use the paste as it is . If I feel the need for more binder I add
either acrylic or bone glue. Mostly for paper works the stuff sinks into the
paper enough to not need anything. This is good for light tints. For more
power, binder and size make the paint sit up on top.

>Kramer ...
There is a catalog. I usually just go there. Being American I do go back.
As for recommendations I can only say that I like to have both a warm and a
cool in each of the primaries and I go through lots of the weaker colors
like yellows. My interests vary, so the pigments I use change from time to
time. I use Ralph Meyer as a guide to permanence.

D

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From: "Jean Eger" <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 01:40:17 -0800
Subject: [Baren 3284] Busted or resawn?

Graham,
When I brought my basswood boards into El Cerrito Mill and Lumber, the man
behind the counter said he didn't know if they could cut it down and he'd
have to ask the shop steward, because it was not their wood.  And also that
they could not cut 13" wide wood, because the blade only went up to 12".  So
we went back into the shop where the workers were taking a break and sitting
around talking.  The shop steward said no problem, he could do it.  And he
could cut the whole 13".

Then we went back into the store to write it up.  The counter man asked the
other counter man, who was wearing the red hard hat, if "resawn" was the
right term.  The hard hat man said no, call it "busted."  He probably
thought we didn't have enough to discuss on Baren and was giving us
something to chew on.

They said they would have the boards done by the next afternoon and I should
call before I came in so they could pull my job.  When I called, the man on
the telephone complained that I was trying to put pressure on them and they
couldn't get it done any faster and most jobs take 3 or 4 days.  And they
would call me when it was ready, which is what they normally do.  So I said,
oh, I didn't know that and thank you and so forth.  Then they called the
next day to say it was ready.

One just has to go with the flow around here.

Peace,

Jeaneger

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End of Baren Digest V6 #465
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