[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking.

Baren Digest              Thursday, 26 August 1999      Volume 08 : Number 679


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From: April Vollmer & John Yamaguchi <jy6@columbia.edu>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 09:13:42 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Baren 5436] Errors

My best prints are the most labored over ones, where I plan and think about
the composition, the color, the cutting, and then, after I put months of
thought and work into it,  letting go, and finding something extra,
unexpected that happens in the process.

Control, control, control, then something else, not an 'error' exactly, but
something unpredictable.

My approach  isn't a good recipe for collaborative work! Love those Ukiyo-e
collaborations, but not for me!

April Vollmer

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From: April Vollmer & John Yamaguchi <jy6@columbia.edu>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 09:24:12 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Baren 5437] Photos

Thank you so much Dave, a great webmaster!
http://woodblock.com/forum/activities/activity_frame.html organizes the
photos very well, thank you so much!

April Vollmer

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From: David Bull <davebull@woodblock.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 23:03:07 +0900
Subject: [Baren 5438] Re: Various ....

Jean wrote:
> What's this about a raffle?  Did I miss something?

Aha! Sleeping at the keyboard again I see!  So we can tell that you
haven't read _every_ word of _every_ posting that came in during the
last few days!  

A visit to:
http://woodblock.com/forum/silly

will abate your curiosity ...

***

Greg V wrote:
> I remember my instructor taking a block I had cut and printed, 

> and using the same colors, produce an entirely different print 

Now this is another interesting twist ...  I don't just at the moment
see how this can really be worked into the collaboration exchange that
(may) come together, but I don't want to see this idea fall by.

This is something that could easily be set up to work independently of
the exchanges.  A set of blocks could be passed around the group, from
member to member, along with an empty folio in which the collection of
prints would accumulate.  Each person would look at the wood and the
prints that had been made so far, then make their own version.  They
make and keep as many as they want, put one into the folio, and send the
package off to the next person ...

It could be something easy like my print from Exchange #2, where
everybody could try colour and gradation variations, or something more
complex, that offered more scope for fooling around.

***

Horacio wrote:
> Despite my individualism, I think that Wanda=3D92s proposition of a
> collaborative printmaking process (with the variations suggested 

> by Jeanne, Jean, Pete, Cindy, etc) is very seductive. I would like 

> (I don't know how) to participate.

Well the page at:
http://woodblock.com/forum/collaborations.html

is a starting point for discussion.  I've just updated it to include
some of the suggestions made yesterday.

For myself, I'm very intrigued by Andy's comment the other day that he
wants to explore mixing colour printing with his wood engraving.  What
about it Andy, should you and I get ourselves into the same group in
this Collaborative Exchange and break some new ground?

***

Somebody called 'Barbara' wrote:
> But it is Barbara Hearn not Barbara Mason, you will really have 
> us confused, I already am so busy I hardly know who I am.

Oops!  Oh well, can't win 'em all ...

I've given the page a once-over, and it is now ready to receive reports,
photos, reviews, etc .etc. from all [Baren] members.  I'd like to put
something in there about Graham's workshop of course, and I'd like to
have some description of April's event to go along with the photos.

http://woodblock.com

.. and select 'Events and Activities'

Dave

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From: Cucamongie@aol.com
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 10:27:41 EDT
Subject: [Baren 5439] more "mistakes" stuff

Wow - it's hard to keep up w/reading all the posts these days... anyway, just 
to bother some of you a little more, well, would you call the flatness, lack 
of perspective, distortion, etc in Japanese prints "mistakes"?? to me, all 
that is great of course.  Plus, I think just within the nature of hanga, you 
will notice little imperfections and irregularities of texture, etc in the 
paper or the print even in some prints done by the "masters" - as for Gary's 
cooking analogy, please lighten up!  I think we're all constantly learning & 
working on improving the technical aspect of artmaking, but as I've said 
before, good technique does not equal good art - perhaps I'm rambling, I 
think I'd better get back to printing!  (I'm doing some imperfect proofs 
today, experimenting w/colors!)
best to all,
Sarah

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From: Graham Scholes <gscholes@home.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 08:06:09 -0700
Subject: [Baren 5441] Re: more "mistakes" stuff

Sarah wrote....
>as I've said before, good technique does not equal good art

You sound like my teacher who drilled this into our brain.
49 (sounds better than 50) years ago they used the assist of a rule, on the
back of the head, to help get it through our thick skulls.  Ah those were
the days....

Good to be reminded Sarah ... thanks

Graham

Beauty is in the eye of the beerholder...

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From: "Jeanne N. Chase" <studiojnc@prodigy.net>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:25:44 -0400
Subject: [Baren 5442] Silly season posting 

For a slow summer, the e mail postings are piling up!
Perhaps the silliness is good for all of us at this time.

Great ideas flow forth from all of the Baren wits. So many that it is hard
to select the best of them.
However, I think Andy has a good idea and I vote for his!!!!

I would like to contribute a fantastic idea for a future Portfolio Exchange.
Sometimes we do not know the best work that we have accomplished. I know
that the ones I do not like sometimes are the first sold, or praised and
this often surprizes me.

What if;   We had a Portfolio Exchange and submitted what we thought was not
a good print , but one that we almost threw out because it was so bad.
Would we be honest and REALLY submit a bad piece?  Would ego get in the way?
Just a thought.

quote from Delacroix   "Artists who seek perfection in everything are those
who cannot attain it in anything."

Dave;
What a life, and you are reaping the rewards for such a dedication.

Jeanne

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From: Karla Hackenmiller <khackenm@bmtc.net>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 12:03:59 -0600
Subject: [Baren 5443] Re: Baren Digest V8 #678

The project of the "exquisite corpse" is a popular one among
printmakers, especially for exchange portfolios.  Oscar Gillespie and
Larry Schuh (Bradley University, IL) organized an intaglio folio in
which each artist created a plate, printed an edition from it, split the
plate into thirds and sent the mid and lower section to assigned
participants.  When each person had all three plates, they assembled
them and printed an edition from them.  So in each portfolio you
received each artist's original image and also the collaborative image.
It is a Gorgeous collection of prints.

This semester I have arranged my beginning print class with a surrealist
angle.  We will be playing surrrealist games and have organized a folio
similar to the above, but in relief.  It's called "Personal Demons".

I think that these kinds of collaborative projects are very eye-opening
and refreshing.

Karla Hackenmiller
University of Nebraska at Kearney

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From: "Horacio" <horacio@centroin.com.br>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 13:54:42 -0300
Subject: [Baren 5444] Re: Collaboration 

Suggestion about collaborative printmaking.
As you know, my figurative prints are black and white.
http://www.analisevital.com.br/xilograv.htm
Sometimes I consider to experiment putting colors on some of them, but
always give up because of the lack of time (due to my professional duties).
So, I prefer spend my precious free hours in new black and white prints or
writing short stories.
Besides that, I must confess my incompetence to deal with colors.
My egoistic suggestion:
The first participant of a group submit, on Baren=92s web site or in his/her
own web site, alternative master prints/key blocks (or drawings of tentative
master prints/key blocks) in black and white to the other members of his/her
group to choose one to be object of a collaborative process.
After the master print/key block is chosen, the first participant would sent
the master/key block to the following member on the printing production
line, who will be responsible for designing the other blocks (using or not
the original master/key block in a reduction method) necessary to make a
color print.
After that, other participants of the group adhere to the work flow until
the print is completed.
I hope you understand my suggestion.

Horacio.

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From: Laohuxu@aol.com
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 14:06:14 EDT
Subject: [Baren 5445] Re: more "mistakes" stuff

Hi everyone.

After being a list-lurker for some time, I'm ready to timidly crawl out. My  name's Liz  Horton; I've taken printmaking classes at a local arts school and been bitten  by the  printmaking bug. I'm constantly amazed and inspired by the beautiful work you  guys  all do, and hope to join in one of the printmaking exchanges soon.

Re some of the recent topics under discussion: "Mistakes": How do we define a mistake? Something we didn't intend to happen?  An  imperfection? One of the things I love about printmaking is that things don't  always  turn out as you planned, but you have endless opportunities to revise,  overprint,  recarve, reink, etc. until you get an image you're pleased with. It may be  nothing at  all like what you originally imagined--but often it's better. The vision in  your head  wrestles with the intransigence of the world, which pushes you to go beyond  what  only existed in your mind. Mind grappling with matter. Perhaps  "imperfections" are  part of the effect you want.

"Collaborating with the world" is (for me!) one of the central satisfactions  of  printmaking (besides the fact that you can give away or sell your art and  still have  some left for yourself!). I wouldn't feel like a printmaker if I created a  plate and then  had someone else print it; even less so if I made a drawing and someone else  created the plate and printed it--even if they could do it a million times  better than I  could. I guess I have a problem with person-to-person collaboration ;-). But  there's  also the question of allocation of the limited time we all have. I'm  interested in book  arts; I'd love to do books that  include my own etchings and my own poetry,  printed  in letterpress, for example, but who knows if I'm ever going to get the time  to learn  letterpress printing? So in the meantime I might have to settle for computer  printouts,  or get someone else to set the type for me. I guess what I'm getting at is  that in the  pursuit of whatever kind of "perfection" we have in mind, we have to make  choices  about what parts of the process we'll spend time on, what parts we'll skimp  on--or  produce on a "different level of perfection"--and what parts we'll be willing  to rely on  other people for. Everyone probably has a different balance. 

Anyway, I'll stop rambling on now. Hope I didn't offend anyone! Glad to be  part of the  list.

Liz Horton 
Englewood, NJ 
laohuxu@aol.com

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From: "Philip Smith" <smithart@pacifier.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:18:47 -0700
Subject: [Baren 5446] Re: Silly season posting 

Dave,....You know I look forward to sitting down every morning with my cup
of tea and reading the comments, passionate comments, from the various
members,..it reminds me of my days at CCAC in Oakland Calif. about 100 years
ago,...someone wrote that drawing is a mystery to students at his
school,...to be sure, to many people want to build houses but they forget
the foundation,....and the discussion on the division of labour,...in
business this is the order of the day,...I remember seeing a photograph of a
room full of engravers busy craving endblocks,...there must have been 60
guys in this room,..they were just the engravers, they didn't illustrate the
shoe, or duck, or lady with child, they just made this wood block for the
letterpress, out of boxwood, for the publication they were working on,...and
commercial work is that way,...there was this fellow in India printing
fabric, with a woodblock,..a fellow in GB doing wallpaper with a
woodblock,...and does anyone remember seeing the old circus
posters,?..woodblocks.!!
And I think this is what Dave was explaining,...this old division of labour
was because these Japanese publishers were in business,...trying to make
buck,..er, yen! ..........so fine art is the luxury of being inspired?
Having someone else pay the rent while you create? Right?...The commercial
art of today is the fine art of tomorrow is one way of looking at
it............
Philip

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From: "Cyndy Wilson" <cwilson@cet.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:43:10 -0700
Subject: [Baren 5449] Re: Collaboration (To Cut or Not to Cut)... 

> Well, I must be crazy for encouraging this lunacy, but hop over to:
> http://woodblock.com/forum/collaborations.html
> ... and let me know what you think.

I think that it's a good idea and the draft that you've posted for an
Exchange 5 seems to have covered most everything.  It might make things
easier (at least the first time this sort of collaborative effort is
attempted) to have members of each group be within a certain geographic
area.  Not necessary, but easier.  I know that there are quite a few of us
in the Pacific Northwest.

Cyndy Wilson

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From: "Cyndy Wilson" <cwilson@cet.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 11:53:44 -0700
Subject: [Baren 5450] Re: Various .... 

> A set of blocks could be passed around the group, from
> member to member, along with an empty folio in which the collection of
> prints would accumulate.  Each person would look at the wood and the
> prints that had been made so far, then make their own version.  They
> make and keep as many as they want, put one into the folio, and send the
> package off to the next person ...

You're cooking now Dave!!  The above would be great fun!  Then you would
post the prints from the folio so that we could see how each member had
handled it? (More work for you...)

Cyndy

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From: John Ryrie <j.ryrie@pgrad.unimelb.edu.au>
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 05:07:29 +1000
Subject: [Baren 5453] Re: Collaboration=20

Another idea for a future collaboration would be to fined  a similar web site
of Poets. Who could supply work to be interpreted.
John Ryrie

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From: "Jean Eger" <jeaneger@LanMinds.Com>
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 04:53:02 +0900
Subject: [Baren 5455] Date: Thu, 26 Aug 1999 12:48:58 -0700 

Here's another collaboration idea:

Someone selects or designs a print.  This could be a print from the Japanese
masters, Hokusai or Hiroshige, or someone Dave likes.

The design is enlarged and divided up into 30 rectangles.  Each participant
is given one of the rectangles to cut and print in their own inimitable
style.  (Should the printing be done full-bleed, i.e, printed all the way to
the edges of the paper?) The organizer  receives the prints when done and
redistributes them in beautiful portfolio covers.

Presto, each participant has a composite collaborative masterpiece.

This idea was inspired by my San Francisco State teacher, Barbara Foster,
and modified by me for this forum.

Jean Eger

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End of Baren Digest V8 #679
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