[Baren]: The mailing list / discussion forum for woodblock printmaking. Baren Digest Monday, 25 October 1999 Volume 09 : Number 756 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- From: "Horacio" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 12:51:44 -0200 Subject: [Baren 6377] Re: various Dave wrote: >I see you've joined the 'colour' brigade! This seems like quite a big >step for a 'black & white' man ... Why did you decide to do this, >Horacio? Dave, I enjoy your comment. In fact, I did some pleasant experiments with color prints in the past and intend to do more in the future, but I do categorize myself as an uncureable definitive "black & white man". Even when I'm doing color prints, I use a black key block over color background. http://www.analisevital.com.br/xilograv.htm That doesn't imply that I don't like color prints. On the contrary, I enjoy a lot the Japanese, the Barener's, Gauguin's and many others prints. But, of course, I have more affinity with Posada, Kate Kollwitz, Durer, Goya, Grilo etc. Josephine wrote: >So the artist is left with the dilemma of choosing whether to satisfy >the art world and critics and thus gain recognition, or whether to make >something that is saleable and thus eat In my opinion, those two options (critics or market) are secondary. I believe that, before anything, the artist must satisfy himself. The artist must be the artist's obsessive target. A real artist should print to himself, compose, write, make sculptures, make films to himself (not to win the Oscar award). My favorite artists (Egon Schiele and Van Gogh) enforce my thesis, I think. If you make the art that you enjoy, that come from your interior, with no concessions, you are a real artist, hence critics and market will have to accept you. If not, worst for them. Yes, the artist have to eat. Nothing wrong being a waitress/waiter, teacher, systems analyst, taxi driver etc... My opinion, of course, is not to be taken too much into account. I'm only an amateur part-time printmaker with no formal art education. Despite being a printmaker for a longtime, I've never sold any print. (except a couple of acquisition prizes in official exhibitions). But I don't care. My friends and colleges like my prints, the public in the exhibitions too, the Bareners made positive comments about my work. That's enough for me. In fact, I print and write to live, to survive. I would be mad if I did not have this paralel artistic life. For example, about 5 years ago, I had a serious problem on my retinas, and lost part of vision. I got very upset, paranoid, I believed that I would not be able to make prints anymore (the eyes problem is now under control and I can print and drive again). But, one night, after six or more Scotch whiskies, I wrote a small fictional text (I've never did that before) that became the chapter one of my first novel. Since then, I'm writing novels and short stories. Oriented to the critics? to the market? Of course not!!. I write stories that I would like to read. A week ago, one of the Brazilian biggest publishers sent me a contract that I will sign this afternoon. They will publish my first novel: "O Espelho de Egon" (Egon Schiele's Mirror). Amanda wrote: >Horacio, wonderful work. Your cuts are beautiful and characters are great. - -Amanda Yopp Tucson, AZ Thank you Amanda. Your comment made me happy. Horacio Rio Brazil ------------------------------ From: "Jean Eger" Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 01:09:49 +0900 Subject: [Baren 6379] Re: selling out, etc. In all fairness the the university, I must say that we made several trips to fine art print publishers such as Crown Point Press, (http://www.crownpoint.com/html/home.html) who are obviously in business to sell prints. There were jobs as master printers that one could aspire to. That was at the time of the discussions as to whether the printers should sign the prints along with the artist of record. The artists were, for the most part, famous painters who had been invited to work in the printmaking medium with the assistance of the master printers. So there was a collaboration there. They were also beginning to send some woodcuts to Japan to be executed. I was mystified about how an artist could sign a print that someone else had cut and printed because I was not yet acquainted with the traditional division of labor in Japanese woodblock printing. Crown Point Press donated their archives to the Fine Arts Museums of San Francisco. They are housed at the Legion of Honor (http://www.thinker.org/) and are available for viewing by appointment, I think. Probably not wanting to discourage us from making art, the university did not point out that it takes years of practice to acquire the skill to become a master printer and a great artist. The skill would not be acquired in one semester: only an outline of the techniques. It would have been helpful to me to understand the levels of being an artist, from Sunday painter to professional. Perhaps that would be a worthy research project to undertake as an adjunct to teaching high school. Does anyone know of a good book on the subject? As President of the printmaking guild at the University, I helped organize one of the annual Christmas print sales, in which the students are asked to contribute prints for sale and the professor prices them from $1 to $10. Faculty prints could cost as much as $50. I still have many prints that my student loan money purchased. I think it was a way of hooking us into becoming collectors. It is also an important experience to see our precious work sold for $1 and $2. It reminds me of the stories about Japanese prints being used to wrap pottery that was exported from Japan. I probably should have studied painting and built on what I already knew. But it was my big chance to learn something new, so I majored in printmaking. Yes, I really fell in love with printmaking. Now I feel like I am taking my clothes off in public. If Ray Esposito were here, he would probably tell me to stop talking so much. Jean Eger ------------------------------ From: "David Stones" Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 02:41:43 +0900 Subject: [Baren 6383] Re: That's a............ Dear All, I've been following the notes on "pretty pictures" and "selling out" - and like Bea Gold, the discussion is very timely - but for me, a little different. My next solo show (the 17th) opens this week and some points that have come up on [Baren] have been added to the considerations of what to show, where to hang it, how big to print out the title and price... how many backups, etc., etc. 1999 print-working reality in real time. The prints have now moved from my workshop to my commercial venture and the printwork that's been done over the past few years is to be proven as marketable or not - it's long-passed my artistic "satisfaction" tests so there's no problem of whether the work's ready. BUT, I'll need the acceptance of the buying public - who have done me very proud in the past - to keep the financial side of life moving. So, why was this last body of work created and for whom then? Who is next week's show for? To be honest, I do NOT exactly know. I've created what I felt and seen, in a style that some have (kindly) said is "Stones" (or Ishita, a penname) - and would now like to show and sell - yet I've not escaped Maria's ultimate dilemma either... as in my NEXT print I'm always going to improve on the last one and put that something that's missing into the next work... But, what's now to be on the gallery wall is done, and I don't hanker to recarve, redraw or reprint it... So, how about the business end? And this shouldn't be kept silent about anymore either - tell those art college teachers to get real - if you print ??? copies of a design, you're indicating you may sell. For us here, with Japan's stumbling economy, it's not easy to "be a woodblock printer" but that's what's on my signboard and, even if I've to do other work besides, so be it. At present, printwork is holding it's financial own yet the printer gets side-tracked these days by having so much else to do - that he wants to do... plus keeping a few of the "odd jobs" to cover the expected slow economic years coming. I've listened to critics, buyers, friends, etc... then taken what I'd liked and used it... whether this is selling out, I don't know - but I do know the nicest compliment is when you've a sold print hung somewhere that no longer has its title and price label and someone says, that's a... (place name here!) ...print you know... Ishita ------------------------------ From: Jack Reisland Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 08:09:23 -1000 Subject: [Baren 6384] Re: If you clicked on the print, you were looking at the work of Gustave Baumann, hanga. If you clicked on the "Exhibitions" link, you were viewing a whole lot of artists, a who's who of turn of the century western printmakers. These are pretty much all hanga, although I'm not familiar with all of them, so a few might be oil based ink. Some of the artists represented actually had their prints printed by Japanese publishers, can't get much more "hanga" than that. Dave has many of these artists in the Baren Encyclopedia, look in "Directories", subsections "Collaborative Prints" and "Turn of the Century Prints". Jack ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 13:21:28 -0500 Subject: [Baren 6385] Re: MGCshow & mORE Hi Cindy and others that have offered to help with the upcoming Baren show at my local library. Thank You, I welcome the help since I think I am the only Baren member in the Chicago area. I will be meeting witht the library's Public Director sometine next month and then I will know more about their requirements and expectations. Right now they have set April 2000 as a tentative show date. I want to throw this out there to all the contributing Baren exchange members. It looks like the available exhibition space could accomodate 40 - 60 of our Oban (10.5 X 15") size prints ...right now they have mix-media works from a local Art group and the works (50+) are stacked on top of each other way too close for my taste....I like more of a professional look with a little spacing in between works...after all the great reviews, I am waiting to see photos of the MGC show. Looks like all the frames are hung by wire on a single nail. Don't know if they will let me drill four holes per print..... Since the Exchange #1 has already "hung" on at list two places....will members object to an exhibition combining prints from ALL the exchanges completed ? This will give me a chance to include more members (assuming more than 30 prints in the show) for this exhibition. By March.....we should probably be working on exchange #5....and I can include prints from #1 thru #4.........as "curator" (if that's the appropriate title for what I would be doing!) I could get input from those members that have participated in multiple exchanges as to which of their print(s) they would like exhibited......or then again......I could just pick my favorite ones.... What do you think ???? Julio ps.....lot of good thoughts on the latest "pretty pics" discussion......more on this later... ------------------------------ From: "Philip Smith" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 11:54:45 -0700 Subject: [none] Hello Georga,...Jack said about everything I could have said about those Annex Gallery prints,....and I think everybody knows most of the "news" I mention,..but just in case someone doesn't,...the big print show in NYC [the International Fine Print Dealers Asso.] I think it's www.printfair.com .... is on the 4th of next month at the armory,...I'll miss it again,...alot of the stuff I read about I get out of "Journal of the Print World" a quarterly pub. out of New Hampshire just in case you don't subscribe and would like to, they are at PO Box 978 Meredith, NH 03253-0978,...it's $22.00 bucks a year, tabloid size and there's 68 pages in this issue which I got in today,...I really enjoy the publication,.....and no, I don't own it!!!! But there are alot of web addresses of different shows & galleries,...you might want to check it out,...and I think they'll sell you a sample issue for $6,............ Philip ------------------------------ From: "Philip Smith" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 12:13:59 -0700 Subject: [none] Julio,...I was just about to get up when your message popped in,...standardize the outsize dimensions, paper size 10 by 15 is good, ..let everyone pick or send you what they want, ready to hang..and call the show "Julio and friends" subtitled something like "woodcuts from members of the Baren",.....and if you get to many efforts from all of us you might consider a double row around the room,....maybe Jack or Graham could give some more experience thoughts,...and you're right, keep a more professional look to it,.....good luck Julio Philip ps How's Mr. Vandercook and his brother? ------------------------------ From: Julio.Rodriguez@walgreens.com Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 14:50:33 -0500 Subject: [Baren 6388] Re: thanks Thanks Philip.......I could just call the show "Me and Julio down by the schoolyard" ....oops...I mean the library lobby. I probably don't want people to be sending me "special" or additional prints for this.......the show should come from prints belonging to the Baren exchanges.....I think ? Mr. Vandercook and his little brother (Vandy) are doing fine...all cleaned and ready to go.....if I get a chance I will upload a photo and a scan of the first print pulled from little Vandy over to the Show & Tell section in Baren. I almost forgot, someone had trouble with my email id......it should be: julio.rodriguez@walgreens.com Thanks.....Julio ------------------------------ From: "Jeanne N. Chase" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 16:45:38 -0400 Subject: [Baren 6389] Re: Library show plus Dear Julio That is a very gracious contribution to the Baren group. I , for one would not mind if you, THE CURATOR, selected the prints for the show in your library. I agree with you .re; crowding the prints. I remember seeing photos of old shows in Paris where they hung everything up to the ceiling. It really looked jumbled. As far as Beauty in art is concerned. I have been reading the posts and it is really subjective. \Would we call Monet.s water lilies ,pretty pictures? As long as the artist believes in what she or he is creating , then it is art. We all have our preferences. For instance; I would not call Leroy Neimans Sports "prints", art. But look at the prices they command. I would argue that he has a very good agent!!!! Twenty years ago or more, when my husband had a frame shop. His agent came by and tried to sell my hubby some LeRoy Neiman prints. We both said yuch and passed. Now, they are worth a small fortune. But 100 years from now people will say Leroy Neiman? Who? Just my humble opinion. THere is nothing wrong with making money in art as long as you do art the way you want to, without thinking "Will it sell?" Just an aside; I just returned from a short journey to judge an Art Show. There were NO prints in the show at all, although the show was opened to all medias. Mostly watercolores and oils. Pelicans, flowers, palm trees, sailboats. Now there is nothing wrong with any of these subjects, but I was hopping to find a little creativity in the mediums that were submitted. I have been a painter for umpteen years. My friends think I am nuts to stop painting and to do JUST prints. Oh well, cie le vie (sic) Jeanne N ------------------------------ From: "Jeanne N. Chase" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 17:03:40 -0400 Subject: [Baren 6390] Re: Magazine, Phillip Thanks for the info. on the New Hampshire Print Publication. And here I thought that The Printmaker from Merry Old England was the only printmaking magazine around!!!! Jeanne N ------------------------------ End of Baren Digest V9 #756 ***************************